Questions on Newspapers online formatting

By SeekingAnswers on Fri, 03/03/2023 - 20:45

Forums

Good day EE editor,

I am continuing on my quest to gain a better understanding of the basics, at least that is where I think I am at right now. That is the problem with self learning I never really know where I am at.   

Currently I am studying citations regarding newspapers online offered by a third party provider.

Using the citation example 14.22 on page 808, Newspaper Articles (Online images) and various forum posts, I have documented my format as:

      Source list entry

      Jurisdiction. Newspaper title. Dates examined. Database with images. Website title. URL: year                  accessed.

     Full reference

     Author, Article Title, Newspaper title, Issue Date, Page & Column; imaged in DB owner/creator, DB title,        database with images, Website owner/creator, Website title (URL: date accessed), path or search                criteria; citing x (if required).

     Subsequent detail

     Author, Article Title.

     The bold text (sorry couldn't figure out how to make colored) represents my adjustment to the citation           format which I created from pg 808 and also my reading on the forum posts.

 

May I ask for your guidance on a few things please? As I write out my issues I am beginning to guess at a few.

  1. Is the jurisdiction for the original newspaper or the website?
  2. In reading the source list entry I feel that without the red text, the reader would interpret source as a physical object being cited rather than a database. Is this correct thinking?  Do I need to add the item type e.g. newspaper to the citation entry and notes or should I assume that the reader would know based on the type of information contained in the citation? 
  3. One thing has puzzled me for a while, in the post “Do you layer source entries and subsequent reference notes” on 06/05/22 (https://www.evidenceexplained.com/node/2037) near the bottom of the piece, there are two source list entries.  One for a document focus and the other for a database focus. In the document focus source list entry, I was not expecting the “Original register. Imaged as DB title” to be added. Is it not mixing apples and oranges? Would you be so kind as to explain why? Should this be added to every source list entry where I am using a database particularly FamilySearch and Ancestry data providers?
  4. I am confused with how to present the path/search criteria. More and more I am required to enter different kinds of parameters to search for records eg quotes for specific text, radio buttons, slider for dates. Do we assume the reader understands how to enter the criteria or do we need to be specific as to the type of field corresponding with which data in the citation? Also do we need to add labels for the text entry fields even on simple screens such is the case with Library and Archives Canada Census screens? Once a search button is clicked then a list of possible items appears.  Do we need to tell the reader which one to select or do we assume there is sufficient information in the citation that the reader can find it on their own?
  5. When the database owner/creator, website owner/creator, and name of the website are all the same, it appears that we enter the name only once and the others are left blank?  Is there a precedent?

 

Here is an example

Source list entry

England. Wales. Bridgend. The Glamorgan Gazette. 1890-1919. Database with images. The National Library of Wales. https://www.library.wales: 2023. 

Full reference

“Moving Story of Battlefield: Bridgend Brother’s Tragic Discovery during Charge,” The Glamorgan Gazette, 15 Jan 1917, p 8, col 1; imaged in The National Library of Wales, “Newspapers,” database with images, The National Library of Wales, The National Library of Wales (https://newspapers.library.wales: accessed 3 Mar 2023) search: “Alfie Thomas”, english publication only, 1890-1919, all articles. 

Subsequent detail

“Moving Story of Battlefield,” The Glamorgan Gazette, 15 Jan 1917.

 

Many thanks for all your assistance, it is very much appreciated.  

Sue

(sorry the input form does like me adding in lines for clarity) 

Submitted byEEon Sat, 03/04/2023 - 09:58

Good morning, Sue. My apologies for keeping you waiting so long. We had tempestuous weather and powers outages here yesterday and last night.

Question 1.

The tag for this field is actually location, not jurisdiction. (See the QuickCheck Model at p. 785 [EE 3d ed., rev. 2017] for the tags that identify each field or element in a newspaper citation.) As a general rule across all kinds of usage, the term jurisdiction refers to official areas of official agencies.  Ergo, the place name that is placed in this field of a newspaper citation is the place where the newspaper is published. 

Another way to understand this is to recall the basic format for citing publications. When we cite a book, newspaper, or similar standalone publication, we cite the place where it is published.

Question 2:

As you noted, something went amiss with the posting and the “red text” to which you refer is not there. However, whether you use a physical copy of a newspaper at a library or use image copies online, the basic citation to the newspaper is the same.  If, in your Source List Entry for the newspaper, you choose to include the online database, then the citation to the database includes all the items that it would include if you made that database citation a standalone entry of its own.  (This need triggers an alteration in your Source List Entry for the Glamorgan Gazette, as noted below.”

Question 3.

In the citation you reference from https://www.evidenceexplainend.com/node2037, the inclusion of the database in the Source List Entry for the imaged register is essential because there is no other location identified where that original register can be accessed.

Question 4.

Your frustration with the many different ways that online material is delivered is totally understood and shared by likely all of us. We’re more than two decades into this adventure into cyberspace and our travel modes are still unstandardized.

No, we cannot assume that a reader understands our intent. That said, EE cannot give you a basic set of words that will fit all situations. (We try, but the cleverness of IT constantly outpaces us.)  Ergo, analyzing the delivery mode or path and deciding how to explain it in our citation is a situation every user faces with each source used.

Question 5.

Yes. See 4.18 (section: “citing company as author”) and 11.5—and countless other citations throughout in which we say

• “Database Name,” Ancestry (https: …) or

• “Database Name,” FamilySearch (https: …) or

• “Database Name,” National Archives (https: …)”

without repeating the company/agency name as the author.

 

Your specific citations:

You’ve done well. EE would tinker here and there, based on what I experienced or saw when I followed your path.

Source list entry

England. Wales. Bridgend. The Glamorgan Gazette. 1890-1919. Database with images. “Welsh Newspapers.” The National Library of Wales. https://www.library.wales: 2023. 

Full reference

“Moving Story of Battlefield: Bridgend Brother’s Tragic Discovery during Charge,” The Glamorgan Gazette, 15 Jan. 1917, p. 8, col. 1; imaged in The National Library of Wales, “Welsh Newspapers,” database with images, The National Library of Wales, The National Library of Wales (https://newspapers.library.wales: accessed 3 Mar. 2023), search terms: “Alfie Thomas”, English publications only, 1890–1919, all articles, Search > “The Glamorgan Gazette.” 

Subsequent reference:

“Moving Story of Battlefield,” The Glamorgan Gazette, 15 Jan. 1917, p. 8, col. 1.

For the "specific item" field of your Full Reference Note, where you need to provide both search terms and path > waypoints, EE would add the term “Search,” because that is an essential option also. After that, the search switches to a new waypoint on the path—a new page at which we have to choose between a new set of search terms. For that reason, EE would add the > to designate the switch to a new waypoint.

Submitted bySeekingAnswerson Sat, 03/04/2023 - 12:04

Thank you for your explanations and encouraging words that I am on the right track.  There was no need for an apology as your reply was faster than I anticipated! We too are in the middle of a snow storm. 

I submitted a comment to this yesterday, but apparently it got lost along the way... so here goes again!

I tried finding your article a different way, namely, navigating to the newspaper, then finding the specific edition, page number, etc. However, when I did that, I noticed that there was no 15 January edition of The Glamorgan Gazette - it seems the article was actually in the 5 January edition! Just thought you'd like to know.

https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3886865/3886873

I suppose this raises a question - is it really necessary to include the final waypoint section in your citation about how you got to the article? And wouldn't it be better to include a direct URL link to the article somewhere? I know If I'm reading someone's work, I'm more likely to do what I did (access the article by selecting the paper and the issue date, or clicking a direct URL link). Perhaps the wayfinding information is better kept in your research notes?